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Forum Update: Community Declined Logos


ADMIN

ajleroux
2021-02-01

Now that we are over the 100K logos mark we think it's a good time for the community to have more power to decline logos. Here are the changes:

1. As before, if a logo receives 3 No votes in community review before it receives its first Yes vote, the logo is declined with the decline reason "Community Declined". In the past you were immune to community declines if you had at least one previously approved logo. We changed that so that the community can decline logos by any new designer. You now have to reach the Silver designer rank to be immune to community declines.

2. Admins no longer check community declined logos to rescue ones that we think should not be declined.

3. You can appeal! If you don't agree with the community's verdict, click the "Appeal" button, located on the page that explains why the logo was declined. No need to upload the logo again. An admin will re-review the logo and either approve the logo or side with the community and decline it. Appeals are limited. You have one appeal per week and you must appeal within 2 days of the logo being declined.

Suggestions welcome! :)



DESIGNER
danang sa
2021-02-01
Edited 2021-02-01 by danang sa permalink ANCHOR

"getting harder" but, look ok.



DESIGNER
WelySuganda
2021-02-01

nice improvement



DESIGNER
Congcorang
2021-02-01

need more struggle.
Keep the spirit :)



DESIGNER
kassymkulov
2021-02-02

It might look like getting harder for new designers, that's why it's best you guys try to get to the silver level as soon as possible :) All your problems will go away incl. receiving payments on time etc.

@ajleroux
Nice improvement :)



DESIGNER
aefirit
2021-02-02

LG Staff and ajlroux, congrats for the new mark :D Also, amazing new feature, this will reduce tasks for admins and community too, glad to know about this good new.

Blessings



DESIGNER
Paradische
2021-02-02

If there is a silver designer up who isn't in the mood then hit the decline button on our logo beginners what about?



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-02
Edited 2021-02-02 by ajleroux permalink ANCHOR

Hi Paradische,

We thought about that too. :)

One designer who is in a bad mood can't get your logo declined. You would need 3 designers in a bad mood to decline the logo, and no-one else approving the logo.

We have used community declines for a while now (since May 2020) and until yesterday an admin re-reviewed every single community declined logo. We wanted to make very sure that good logos were not being unfairly declined. Turns out this was unnecessary. Virtually everyone in community review is doing a good job. If someone is dishonest in community review (e.g. just declining everything) the system will flag it for an admin to investigate, but that almost never happens.

And you now have the appeal option, just in case.



DESIGNER
kimiko chan
2021-02-02

Hi Ajleroux,

I welcome the new rules, even though I actually feel uncomfortable :)

I have two questions regarding this new rule,
1. Will every logo approved by the community never get the "staff favorite" label and appear on the front page?
2. If my logo is rejected by the community and I file an appeal then my logo is approved by the admin do I only get 0.4 reputation points? (assuming, rejected by the community: -0.8 then approved by admin: +1,2)



DESIGNER
ferorizki
2021-02-02
Edited 2021-02-02 by ferodesign permalink ANCHOR

the people who vote is random or admin choose it?



DESIGNER
ava_nauval
2021-02-02

So this leaves the newcomers with no choice but to come up with a really dazzling logo :).
Even community's bad mood can suddenly disappear after seeing amazing thing.

Good job LG team!

Then what if there was a pro designer who was really skilled at their job and wanted to build their career here and found facts that the LG community didn't like their works. This really makes them judge that the majority of Lg designers are not really skilled at their job.



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-02
Edited 2021-02-03 by ajleroux permalink ANCHOR

kimiko chan, good questions. Logos that are not declined by the community still go through the normal review process and can still receive the staff favorite banner. If you appeal a community decline, that gives you back the reputation points you lost, so when an admin re-reviews the logo you get the normal average of +1.2 or -0.8.

ferodesign, anyone with a designer rank of Silver or higher can review logos.

ava_nauval, I would imagine that a pro designer who is very skilled would reach the Silver rank within days and until then they would probably never have logos declined by the community. It is common in community review for good logos to get 100% Yes votes, not a single No vote. And it only needs one Yes vote to avoid being community declined. Also keep in mind that the "Almost" option in community review isn't counted. It has to be 3 solid No votes.



DESIGNER
Paradische
2021-02-02

Thank you ajleroux hope this will meet the expectations of all beginners



DESIGNER
kimiko chan
2021-02-02

Hi Ajleroux,

I have one more question,
how long does it take to get a logo approved or rejected? I count there are many designers with silver rank and above, do I have to wait until they all vote? if so, it may take a very long time to wait for a logo to be approved or rejected



DESIGNER
danang sa
2021-02-02

wow.. is this discussion still can change the rule?. i thought it just explanation of new rule as usual,..
thats why i just ok.
without thinking at once at all.
at 1st comment ..XD.
anyway i believe ajleroux has think everything..:)

i get it..
"It Only Need One Yes Vote to avoid community declined".
as ajleroux write above..

meaning got one yes vote. logo still through for next checking.. CMIIw.



DESIGNER
rasagama
2021-02-02

Lets make it simple.
Just improve your design skill instead think you can make money from it. ;)



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-02

kimiko chan, it doesn't go back to community review. If you appeal it goes straight to an admin who will give it a yes or a no within one business day.

danang sa, all rules and systems are up for discussion. We love feedback and often change/add things based on discussions like this one. :)

rasagama, good advice. :) Quality wins.



DESIGNER
neldy
2021-02-03

very interesting, it looks like I want to be reborn and started registering at the beginning of the year LG: D the rules are getting harder but this is a very good challenge for skill improvement :)



DESIGNER
CrossTheLime
2021-02-03

@neldy - why? Just be proficient enough to become Silver. :) That does not change when you signed up!



DESIGNER
hloke
2021-02-03

Hello! great news, thanks for making this wonderful site better! Hopefully this will help to reduce the number of weak works and motivate designers to new victories!
I really fell in love with this resource, it is very cozy and positive here)



DESIGNER
Wildone
2021-02-06

At the begining I must confront with admin's taste in logo design, now I must please other designers taste? Can I just create logos based on my experience and taste? Please? Instead of concentrating on my craft I must think if the admin/community will like it or not... We are creating logos FOR THE CLIENTS... remember? We spend hours and days creating a logo, we are thinking how to make THE CLIENT happy not anyone else. Ajleroux you are a great guy but I think you put to much attention on your personal taste. Even that exam is based on your taste... LG takes 10%... take 20% but can you please let me be me?



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-06

Hi Wildone,

Many thanks for the feedback.

You may be underestimating the community. The people voting on the logos are designers with proven abilities. They know logos are for clients.

I'm not sure I understand what you are suggesting though. Should we auto-approve new uploads? If this is what you are suggesting, I think you may change your mind later when you reach the Silver level and gain access to community review. There we see 100's of uploads every day that we simply can't present to potential clients - from clip art to photos of designs drawn on paper. We have to have quality control.

If you agree, then we have to decide who will be better at quality control: Admins or the community. I'd say the community, because the more people we have voting on the logos, the smaller the impact of personal taste becomes.



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-06

I forgot to add: The exam is based on the algorithm, not on my taste. See: https://www.logoground.com/algorithm.php



DESIGNER
Wildone
2021-02-06

I invited a few great designers to dinner and proposed them to take your exam. I thought maybe it's something wrong with me, maybe i'm loosing grip ) They all are in ~50%. If you tell that this is algorithm, that explains a lot. I think that a good logo is a good logo and that factor must not depend if that designer has badges or how many views it has. Please do me a favor explain why this logo didn't pass thru your algorithms? And let's search for lion heads on LG and explain why they are non generic and how they passed thru... If a logo is more valuable only because that designer has some badges then you can close the gate for new people.
https://www.logoground.com/uploads9/dv9y20211308452021-02-052514998Alfa%20Lion%20Logo.jpg



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-06

Hi Wildone,

Neither the exam nor this logo are on-topic so I'll just give short answers here. Happy to discuss both at length in separate threads.

Your friends may have different ideas about quality and that's fine. The rankings on LogoGround and in the exam rely on the collective opinions of hundreds of proven designers, which I think gives us a very accurate indication of quality.

The only reason we declined your lion logo is because we truly think it is too generic. If we sell a logo that can't be trademarked, that's not good for you, for us or for the client. It is tempting to compare logos and say "If this one, why not that one?" and to say it is unfair, but that's not productive. There are just too many variables.



DESIGNER
Wildone
2021-02-06
Edited 2021-02-06 by ajleroux (admin) permalink ANCHOR

[Links removed]

I think i can find 10-15 more only your site. Please explain. And if you can find a couple on LG that looks close to mine I won't bother you no more.

P.S Guys if one of these logos are yours don't get offended i love your work i'm not trying to upset nobody I just want to understand why and to be treated equal.



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-06

Wildone, please read the forum rules. You can only comment on another designer's work if they invited comments.
https://www.logoground.com/discuss.php?topic=6

As mentioned in my last post, comparing logos is not productive. It will simply be your opinion against mine and it is unlikely that we will find agreement. Consider that approving logos is in our best interest. If we decline a logo, it is because we truly see a problem.



DESIGNER
Wildone
2021-02-06

LG is full with those Peugeot looking logos, and you have no problems with them. Those look trademarkable to you? And if I ask for a couple of examples why mine is generic... no response... You are the boss, go ahead and erase those links... Why there is a cross at the bottom of the page if you are not treating people equally? True christians don't behave like that.



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-07

Wildone, what motive would we have for treating you differently? What do we gain?

If you have evidence of unfair treatment, please start a new topic and let's discuss it.



DESIGNER
skintani
2021-02-07

@wildone

ahhh come on, don't discuss the cross ... actually I also feel a little disappointed because some of my logos were rejected many times for reasons that made me confused, after I got a "has potential" notification and I uploaded it again after making repairs and I was hit rejection of "Declined Multiple Times", I also thought "am I being cheated on this" but well maybe it is also for my good to be able to produce even better logos, and I forget about it and go back to sketching for a better logo.

I hope not to discuss the cross again, be wise not to confuse problems with symbols.



DESIGNER
Wildone
2021-02-07

There were a lot of topics where people asked what generic means... Nobody knows. I know you deal with a lot of people. But for me it's insulting because i'm that guy who checks everything, I even create each letter from scratch. ajleroux you are a great designer but as LG representative you are the middleman between designers and clients, don't impose your taste on people's work. You have the access to the files, open them and look at the quality. I know it's there because I'm checking every point on those shapes. And if everything is alright there and you didn't see something close then it deserves a green light. People upload THE SAME LOGO a couple of times with small variations, tell them about generic and trademarks don't tell me... Rules must be rules, if you said no more lion heads then why those are still accepted? Because they sell from time to time... And when I tried to upload JUST ONE it got rejected for no objective reason. This is unfair.



DESIGNER
Ortega Graphics
2021-02-07

Wildone,

You should definitely start a new topic instead of derailing the current topic.

The word "generic" has been defined numerous times on the forum, here are two examples:
https://www.logoground.com/discuss.php?topic=1870#17665
https://www.logoground.com/discuss.php?topic=2045#19205

Hope this helps,

Ortega Graphics



DESIGNER
Diwanwr
2021-02-08

excuse me, I want to ask, if my logo is rejected because "Community Denied" can only appeal or can I revise it and upload it again? or create a new one with the same concept..



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-02-08

Hi Diwanwr,

All of the above. :) It's your decision. You can appeal to have an admin re-review the logo, or you can upload an improved version, or a new design.



DESIGNER
loveplus
2021-02-18

okay that will hard but maybe good for LG



DESIGNER
Nawa
2021-02-23

Let's make a better work :)



DESIGNER
taufikasyari
2021-02-23

It's a great improvement



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-12

hi admin,

can you make it easier for the community rejected logo appeal? like one day 3 logos or maybe without limits hehe



DESIGNER
Piars Studio
2021-03-12

great one andre :)



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-03-12
Edited 2021-03-12 by ajleroux permalink ANCHOR

Alvy Wyll, afraid not. :) If we removed the limit then we might as well not have the community decline feature. Since we introduced this feature there were about 1,800 logos that were declined by the community. More than 100 appealed and of those we approved 5. So it looks like the community is doing a great job, not declining logos unnecessarily. I think we should keep the limit at one appeal per week for now. If we see that more appeals succeed in the future we will likely change it so that you can appeal more often.

Many thanks Piars Studio. :)



DESIGNER
Arcello Studio
2021-03-12

I appreciate and enjoy all of LG policy changes. makes me better at making logos, thanks a lot admin...



DESIGNER
CrossTheLime
2021-03-13

Ugh, can the thread be cleaned up? It is useless now.

And wtf has being Christian to do with design? I am not Christian.



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-13

then what about the points we get?



DESIGNER
AndriNdut
2021-03-13
Edited 2021-03-13 by AndriNdut permalink ANCHOR

Wow, the best and very appetizing creations. more precisely if the rejection was accompanied by reasons like the previous admin, I experienced rejection by the community, but not accompanied by reasons and I was confused. I want to go further, and ask for guidance.
unlimited creativity greetings



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-03-13

Arcello Studio, many thanks. :)

CrossTheLime, I wouldn't call it useless. It got sidetracked for a bit. The question about religion has been discussed elsewhere, let's not get into it here. Stay on topic please. :D (Just kidding)

Alvy Wyll, points are lost for community declined logos, just as it would be for admin declined logos. If you appeal you get those points back. If you lose the appeal you lose the points again. If you win the appeal you gain points.



DESIGNER
AndriNdut
2021-03-13

ok, thank you, agree and understand. getting excited about creation.



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-13

I often get community rejections but after I re-upload you receive my logo ...
not just one logo but more. What I regret is when my logo can be said to be pretty good and you like it but the community rejects it before you see it ...
that's very unfortunate sir. That's what I want advice to you to increase the number of logos to be tested against. sorry if i overreacted. thank you



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-03-13

Alvy Wyll, you may have had more than one successful appeal, but as I said there were 5 successful appeals in total, out of more than 100. With the community doing such a good job with reviews I do not see a reason to change it.

Even if you can't appeal every decision, you have the option to improve and re-upload the logo, and there is no limit there. And once you reach the Silver designer level you'll be immune to community declines.



DESIGNER
dickyramadhan514
2021-03-13

as a new designer, I have a lot to learn and put in effort



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-13

Is there a time division for the community to review the logo?



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-03-13

At the moment it is one business day. There is a button that admins click to say "OK, decline all community declined logos" and that happens once per day, every day except Sundays.

We will probably change it in the future so that the system does not wait for an OK from an admin, which will mean logos can be declined within minutes of being uploaded - as soon as they receive too many No votes without any Yes votes.



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-13

wow I have to hurry up to class hahaha



DESIGNER
Hamra Design
2021-03-13

Ohh. I have one. And it is before 24 hours :)



DESIGNER
Syla27
2021-03-13

I think this may be a LG form to enrich the logos - good logos, although I as a new designer who is involved in LG a little bit objection :).
my question is whether a designer with a silver level makes it impossible to make a bad logo? Or what if a silver level designer makes a bad logo? is the logo still acceptable, even if it's actually a little unfair to new designers :)



DESIGNER
siberianhamskii
2021-03-13

Yes, time to improve quality



DESIGNER
ArdiEksanusi
2021-03-13

Syla27
Any designer, If they makes a bad logo, it will be declined.



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-03-13
Edited 2021-03-13 by ajleroux permalink ANCHOR

Yup, any logo can be declined. When you get to the Platinum level we will no longer decline your logos on artistic grounds, but if there is a specific problem with the logo (like it being too generic) it can still be declined even at Platinum level.



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-13

if talking about the quality is a mystery. because what we think is good is not necessarily what other people think is good and vice versa. just think of it as a test for the future to be even better.



DESIGNER
blackpen79
2021-03-13
Edited 2021-03-13 by blackpen79 permalink ANCHOR

Maybe it's time I should go on vacation with my lover to a peaceful country ..., because of my boredom because my logo was rejected many times for various reasons.

And maybe for me to move up to the Silver rank is very difficult, because so many of my logos were rejected that my logo points were approved exhausted.

But I like it here, a lot of new things that I got.

Thank you @ajleroux and all the LogoGround Team



DESIGNER
Hamra Design
2021-03-13

Hmm, can the community conspire to approved its friend's bad logo?



DESIGNER
Hamra Design
2021-03-13

Ohh, i missed point 2.



DESIGNER
rmn2971
2021-03-13

correct me if i'm wrong.

Just to conclude, 'community decline' means that the design is "good enough", there are some designers who approve (because they like it etc.) but there are still many who disagree.
the level is between 'logo has potential' and 'need small improvement



DESIGNER
hellocha
2021-03-13

@Desain Hamra
I don't think it will work, because all decisions to pass are in the hands of the admin



DESIGNER
hellocha
2021-03-13

I think new designers have a lot of good logos to approve. but also has many logos rejected. To get a silver ranking you only need to spend a little time looking back at the logo, making sure everything is correct and of good enough quality. do not rush to upload, because a small mistake can make your logo rejected.



DESIGNER
Ihrul Rizki
2021-03-14

I really like this rule. It's getting harder but on the other hand it can improve the quality of the logo that I made to be better and professional.



DESIGNER
Alvy Wyll
2021-03-15

1 week I was trapped in community rejection and could not make any appeals.



DESIGNER
skintani
2021-06-15

Hi Aj or Team LG

I don't see the "Appeal" button, my logo got Community Declined on 12 june. Should I upload again?



ADMIN
ajleroux
2021-06-15

Hi skintani,

You must appeal within 2 days of the logo being declined. For this logo you will no longer have the appeal option. You get one appeal every 7 days, so it's best to use it sparingly - only when you're sure the community made a mistake.

You can reupload anytime, but I would suggest improving the logo first so that you don't get the same result.

Most of the time I would recommend improving and reuploading, rather than using the appeal option. Admins are approving fewer than 2% of appeals, which means that the community is doing a good job. If they decline a logo, they probably have a good reason. :)



DESIGNER
skintani
2021-06-15

Thanks Ajleroux, I will fix it and upload again



DESIGNER
Hadi w
2021-06-21

Hi All Great Community...

I'm new here with harder condition about logo approval roles.
But one think I know.
Please guide me well.



DESIGNER
LogonisDesign
2021-06-22

Hi everyone!
I've had some experience with LG for last year, will gladly share it or help the newbies.
Good day to all!


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Last post on 2021-06-22

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